Gratitude and Grief Can Coexist

[00:00:03] Speaker A: Welcome to youo Odyssey Podcast, where your guides, Tara and Karen invite you on a transformative journey toward wholeness and personal growth. Each week we'll discuss topics related to the human experience and offer insights to help you along the way. Please note this podcast should not replace medical care or advice. We are not licensed healthcare professionals or mental health therapists. If you enjoyed today's episode, subscribe so you don't miss out on our future discussions. So, explorers, let's dive into today's episode. [00:00:54] Speaker B: Hey explorers, it's Tara. Karen and I are so glad you pressed play today. We're continuing Gratitude Month, but today's conversation is a little tender. We're talking about what it means when gratitude and grief share the same space. How you can feel deep appreciation and deep sorrow in the same breath, and how both can be holy. Y' all ready? [00:01:20] Speaker C: Let's just dive right in here. [00:01:22] Speaker B: Just Tinder. I said it was tinder. [00:01:25] Speaker C: The description of it made me just a little caught in my heart. [00:01:28] Speaker B: Gratitude and grief might sound like opposites, but in reality, they often live side by side. One doesn't cancel the other. Gratitude can soften the edges of grief, and grief can deepen our gratitude for what was. [00:01:47] Speaker C: Just playing. [00:01:49] Speaker B: So often we say focus on the positive, as if gratitude should erase our pain. But real gratitude, the kind that changes us, can hold the ache and the beauty at once. Anytime. [00:02:02] Speaker C: We can expand our awareness and our consciousness to hold more, all at the same time and to recognize that all of it's valid. Ideally, a beautiful teaching. [00:02:15] Speaker B: Yes, yes. So in this episode, we're exploring the tension between gratitude and grief, how gratitude brings healing without erasing pain, and practices for holding both in our stories. [00:02:28] Speaker C: This is gonna be real rich. [00:02:31] Speaker B: I got my tissues if you need them. All right, so let's start with attention. We live in a culture that has and loves and embraces this ego. Either or thinking you're either grateful or you're grieving. You're either happy or you're hurting. But real life doesn't fit into Those neat either, or boxes. [00:02:52] Speaker C: It is not a black and white situation. [00:02:56] Speaker B: There are seasons. There are holidays after the loss. There are milestones that we remember with the person that we love. To be clear, this episode is probably going to focus more on grief related to a person. There are these seasons where gratitude and grief collide. We at one point might find ourselves laughing one moment, crying the next. [00:03:20] Speaker C: The amount of joy we can experience is relative to the amount of grief or sorrow that we can also experience. And those things, however seemingly far apart Balance each other out beautifully. Right. So the larger. The deeper your container is for one. [00:03:35] Speaker B: The deeper it is for the other. And that's not a contradiction like our two sides, as you said of that container. And our gratitude doesn't cancel our grief. It's. It gives it shape. It helps us name the loss, the love behind the loss and the meaning behind the ache. [00:03:52] Speaker D: Right. [00:03:52] Speaker C: There's a very famous quote about the more grief you feel is how much. [00:03:58] Speaker B: Love you feel connection with this person. Holding both emotions, the and, if you will, allows us to stay honest, to be fully alive. To say this hurts and yet I'm thankful. [00:04:13] Speaker C: That's one aspect of the human condition that I think is often overlooked or glazed over. But the challenges and the opportunities, they bring us to a level of awareness in a different or maybe even faster new way that we would not have experienced without that opportunity. So really, all of life is in our favor. I really believe that. Right. I think Einstein said. Right. You either live in. Believe that the world is a friendly and loving or scary, frightening place, whichever you believe is what it is for you. So if you can allow for that, these feelings coexisting and that you can hold all of it and you can learn from it and grow from it, I think that's a beautiful thing. We're so lucky to have that opportunity. It's human. [00:05:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Definitely speaks to the depth of our humanity. This capacity to hold both joy, gratitude, and sorrow in the same heartbeat. How does this gratitude bring healing without erasing our pain? Spoiler alert. Gratitude is not meant to fix grief. It's meant to walk beside it, offering that glimmer of hope and comfort in the midst of our pain. [00:05:31] Speaker C: Gratitude almost deepens the grief. But I mean, by deepening, I mean enriches. [00:05:36] Speaker B: Yeah, right. [00:05:37] Speaker C: Like the gratitude enriches the grief because you're going to experience the sadness of the loss. [00:05:42] Speaker B: Right. [00:05:42] Speaker C: That's inevitable. And you do it with the gratitude, which enriches and has enriched your life in relationship to that person also. [00:05:52] Speaker B: Or even the thing. [00:05:52] Speaker D: Right. [00:05:53] Speaker C: It could be a job loss, it could be a relationship loss, it could be a connection, a community loss. Whatever it is. Yeah, I think it's enriched. [00:06:00] Speaker B: Yeah. It's that gentle companion that reminds us, you know, we may have lost whatever thing is or whoever the person was, but there's something that still holds us here. Like, doesn't amplify the gratitude. When you embrace both, there is a certain layer of complexity that is introduced that if you deny one and lean too hard in the other, like, you wouldn't have. [00:06:23] Speaker C: It's like trying to make a gumbo without that roux. You know what I'm saying? [00:06:27] Speaker B: Right? You need the pieces. [00:06:29] Speaker C: Need all the pieces cooking. I'm not spending seven hours. [00:06:35] Speaker B: You're not. So maybe this gratitude for the love or the thing that we experience, our memories that remain and the people who show up for us to support us in these seasons, they sound like some silver lining. You can in the same breath say, I am grateful I had them, or I'm grateful that I experienced that and still miss it very deeply. [00:07:00] Speaker C: The more beautiful and the more impactful and the more profound and the more deep it was, the bigger the crater. At least initially. [00:07:10] Speaker B: Definitely. [00:07:11] Speaker C: I also have a PhD in grief. I know we've talked about my connection to gratitude, but I also have a PhD in grief. I used to like, be proud of the fact, like I was in college and I lost like four people immensely close to me. I was like, oh, grief, I get it. I've been through it a long time. Like it was a badge of honor in some ways. Maybe it made me more empathic or sensitive, you know, or deepen that. I don't know. But yeah, right. [00:07:37] Speaker B: I mean, you've experienced it this year. [00:07:40] Speaker C: This year, mine was like front loaded in my lifetime. It was like, you have had a year. [00:07:44] Speaker B: This year has been something for the, for the. For the books, for sure. Thinking back on all of the people loss in terms of death. This year I have learned and continue to practice about gratitude and giving it space in my grief. And I can like to what you were saying about empathy, like, empathize with the people who were closer to the person that we lost. Like, empathize with them. And like, it is not demanding that we move on, but it's helping us move through it. I feel like when we deny ourselves that gratitude, like, prolong the grief process from experience, from experience, from experience. [00:08:27] Speaker C: If you don't feel it, you're not gonna deal it. And it's gonna come back. [00:08:31] Speaker B: It's coming back. It's so hard, so big. Right? So let's talk about practices for holding both gratitude and grief. The joy and the sorrow in our stories. What do we say here? So all of the things, it starts with honesty. Name both of those feelings, both of those emotions out loud or. Or in writing, you can journal or whisper to yourself, I'm grieving this and I'm grateful for this. [00:09:06] Speaker C: And in that noticing, allow for the validity of your emotions. Maybe you're pissed off or frustrated. Maybe that person, like you feel like they left you holding the bag on something or there was still so much more to do. Be say, you know, validate all of your feelings around it. [00:09:25] Speaker B: That's when we were first planning for this episode a year ago when I knew, like, I wanted to have a conversation on grief. I thought it was simply going to be like walking through the stages of grief. So I'm like. But as time went on, it morphed into something different. Kind of like how I thought our mother wounds episode would be something entirely different. But as we see. Sit with the feelings, the thought and the process. There's something beautiful here. There's something amazing here. It's sitting with your feelings. Like that awareness, that acknowledgement of. Yep. I'm angry because that's one of the stages, like where you're in denial about this. Sitting with all of those phases and stages and remembering to invite gratitude along in that. [00:10:14] Speaker C: It's like, I'm gonna liken it to an archaeological dig. [00:10:17] Speaker D: Right. [00:10:18] Speaker C: Because it's a hot summer day that's getting in your eyes and it's unpleasant. Get out of my way. But then also, you're like, you find this magical thing, Right. You find this gem that you would not have found if you didn't get in there and dig into the dirt and be in it and feel it and explore it. [00:10:32] Speaker B: Right? Yes. So, explorer, if you are in the middle of grieving, try this reflection. It's identifying what am I grieving and what am I grateful for within it. [00:10:46] Speaker C: Within the grief. [00:10:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:48] Speaker C: Right. Explicitly state what you're grieving and you know what that looks like and feels like to you. [00:10:54] Speaker B: Right. [00:10:55] Speaker C: And find the gratitude. [00:10:56] Speaker B: Yes. So we can also create small rituals that hold both the gratitude and the grief. We can light a candle in remembrance of what we miss. We can offer a prayer of thanks for what remains. Look for one moment of connection that reminds you that you're still being held. I love, like memory candle. Like that whole sacred process and sort. [00:11:23] Speaker C: Of the essence of that person or thing or time of your life is infused into. [00:11:30] Speaker B: Yes. Like, that ritual invites that in. It's like a tangible. Well, maybe you're not holding the flame, but you know what I mean. Also in this. In this duality, we can practice compassion with ourselves when that gratitude feels far away. So don't light yourself up. Or for not being grateful through all of the phases of grief. Part of that comes from allowing ourselves to be comforted by others. [00:11:57] Speaker C: Be honest with where you are. You don't want to inflict the gratitude. [00:12:02] Speaker D: No. [00:12:03] Speaker C: But, you know, the More you sit with the grief. Grief. And allow yourself to be supported. The gratitude will emerge. [00:12:10] Speaker B: Right. [00:12:11] Speaker C: That will just sort of naturally come up. [00:12:12] Speaker B: So when we are allowing ourselves to receive that comfort, we accept the hug, we let the other person help, and we remember that receiving love is part of healing, too. So often we feel like we gotta do this thing on our own. And we think grief is a solo activity, but it shouldn't be. No. [00:12:33] Speaker C: And it can be very isolating. That is the thing. [00:12:36] Speaker B: Right. [00:12:36] Speaker C: Make sure you have some people, two. [00:12:39] Speaker B: Or three, at least lean on them. Just lean on them. [00:12:44] Speaker C: And to sit with you in your unkempt array of feelings and your sadness and your soreness and your pain. [00:12:55] Speaker B: Yeah. It's been a beautiful journey through holding the gratitude and the grief as we sit with what it means to hold space for both. I found a song that beautifully carries the ache and the beauty is Rivers and roads by the head and the heart. [00:13:21] Speaker A: Check out this week's song on the YO Podcast playlist on Spotify. [00:13:30] Speaker B: That. [00:13:31] Speaker C: I mean, what that. [00:13:34] Speaker B: That, like, if y' all did not pause to go listen to this song, listen to the rest of the episode, and then listen to rivers and roads. I feel like I just swam in a river, like, of just beautiful harmony of key. The keys. It's the key. The keys. [00:13:58] Speaker C: And the simplicity. Right. [00:13:59] Speaker B: It was just stripped down to the. So when I was researching the song, it was actually, I think they said, written for family that had moved away to a different state. And so I didn't listen all the way through the song. I just listened to the beginning. But, like, usually I'm just picking, like, reading the lyrics and see if the lyrics feel like the tone that I want. And then I was like, oh, my goodness, this is a very beautiful song. It's like rivers and roads until I see you. And I'm like, what? That's grief. [00:14:35] Speaker C: I feel like we were baptized in some sort of river of sound. [00:14:41] Speaker B: And. [00:14:42] Speaker C: Wow. [00:14:42] Speaker B: So if you did not go to our playlist and listen to it, please, please, please just bathe yourself in rivers and rose by the head and the heart was. That was great. [00:14:53] Speaker D: Oh, man. [00:14:54] Speaker B: That song felt like a beautiful memory about how our love stretches across distance and change and time because. [00:15:04] Speaker C: And frequency. [00:15:06] Speaker B: Listen. Energy just. It's not created or destroy. So let it remind you. Explore that Even as our lives shift, connection and gratitude remain. Okay, okay. [00:15:20] Speaker C: Do you have a question? That was beautiful, by the way. I mean, just like, the experience of the song with you fully through, but then also unpacking that a little Bit because there was just such, like, raw, organic connection of all of the feelings. Right. Do you think that part of the reason why grief is so challenging and also kind of knock you out at the knees is because it now offers us the opportunity to shift our identity. We sort of recreate our identity. Right. Because that person, place, or thing was a solid part of it and I. [00:16:07] Speaker D: Think. [00:16:09] Speaker B: Confirmed, because that is definitely a process that I went through earlier this year. Like, the. Like, I didn't even think of losing the thing in terms of, like, grief and, like, how my identity had been tied up with that thing because it was such a big part of my life until my therapist was like, have you allowed yourself to grieve? [00:16:30] Speaker C: I'm like, you're like, grieve? It was a great. [00:16:33] Speaker B: What? And then I was like, oh, I do need to grieve the loss of this thing and re. Re. Center on what and who I actually am. Like, oh, total shift. Yeah. Yes. Yes. We'll take fell down the pit just in. Oh, wait, that's why I'm in a pit, Chad. I'm grieving. Okay. Okay. [00:16:56] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:16:57] Speaker B: So, yes, I. From recent lived experience. 100. Yes. [00:17:02] Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, I think that's why all of the big life transitions, even, like. [00:17:06] Speaker B: Moving all of it knock the wind out of you. [00:17:10] Speaker C: All of it. It's because it's wrapped up in our identity. [00:17:13] Speaker B: Yeah. And we all know there's been a message that's been dropping the identity over image. Like, who are you? Not who do you pretend? Anyway? So back to the question of the day. [00:17:25] Speaker C: That wasn't enough question. [00:17:27] Speaker B: I mean, I was reading. I'm like, wait, that nicoi. But also, what is something or someone you're grateful for even as you grieve? [00:17:37] Speaker C: Oh, stop it. I don't know. [00:17:40] Speaker B: Oh, who you say, girl, are you going where? That's the first one that. Okay. I'm like, wait, we not going there. Okay. Yeah, but you were like, no, not dead. Think of someone you're grateful for even as you grieve something. I feel like this year, in the year of funerals, I've spoken a lot recently about being grateful for the people that I've lost and the impact that they've had there and how I am grateful for those relationships and how I can choose to honor their legacy, their impact. If I, you know, show up with a little bit of, oh, this person was this way. So let me be lean into that aspect of me. And it's not, like, about changing who I am or changing my identity. And is Appreciating and recognizing in the eulogy what the people said about them and what I want people to say about me when I'm not going to be laid up on the. I'm not going to be laid up. So when y' all come, it's. It's cremation. It was 2000. Fire burn. Listen, I might not even be there, but I'm just like, moment at the celebration of life. Like, what do I want people to say? Who do I want people to remember me as? Like, you know, she worked real hard and she did. Don't talk about none of that. Don't talk about the things I did. [00:19:07] Speaker D: Right. [00:19:07] Speaker C: That's that legacy piece that we've talked about a little bit lately. Like, it's lazy. Is not just, you know, an empire. [00:19:16] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:19:17] Speaker C: Of stuff and things and business and wealth. A legacy is the way that you impact someone's life and for you to body in some way one that you love. [00:19:29] Speaker B: Yes. That impact. Yes. [00:19:30] Speaker C: Beautiful reference. I think that I love that there have been. Would you like to add anything else? No, I'm good. You know, in transition, I feel grief and joy and gratitude. Like, I'm like. [00:19:46] Speaker B: And I. [00:19:47] Speaker C: For me, because I asked that question earlier, I think it's wrapped up in my identity shifting and it's sort of like Quantum leap shifting. [00:19:56] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:57] Speaker C: I'm just like, just on. And Barbie's like, I remember that part of my life, and that was really great for that reason. And so I'm grateful for it and also grateful that I've let that part go. [00:20:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:10] Speaker C: Or that I healed that part of me and that I am moving, accepting the fullness and wholeness of me. And I feel such gratitude in every transition for that. That along with the grief comes recognition that I am getting. I am becoming closer and closer to me becoming. I am getting closer to home. [00:20:38] Speaker B: Right. Coming home to yourself. Like, maybe a tagline. Oh, that is a beautiful. Oh, my goodness. Again, I could not have imagined how amazing this episode would feel and be in the process. So I have a quote. It's a contemporary quote from a TV show, WandaVision. He's one of the avenger people. I was going do like Vision said. But what is grief if not love persevering? [00:21:10] Speaker C: Go Vision. [00:21:12] Speaker B: And I'm like, who wrote that? Like, who was the screenwriter for that? Because that is brilliant. What? Yes. What is grief if not love persevering? [00:21:24] Speaker C: I mean, that says it all, I feel. Yeah. [00:21:28] Speaker D: Beautiful. [00:21:28] Speaker B: Yeah. Vision is reminding us that grief is love that still wants somewhere to go. It lingers because it mattered. [00:21:38] Speaker C: And. Say that one again. [00:21:45] Speaker B: Grief is love that still wants somewhere to go. It lingers because it mattered. Just wanted to give that, give it the space that. Yes. And gratitude helps give that love a voice. It lets us say thank you for what was, thank you for what remains. Gratitude doesn't erase our grief. It gives it form, tenderness and meaning. When we let both exist, we honor the fullness of our story. [00:22:17] Speaker C: Like, and you know, it's like, like this layering, like the, the layer earth, right? It's not just this 1, 2, 3. I miss it is multi layered. Like really have on a life adventure, right? It's just so layered and, and that's. [00:22:32] Speaker D: All part of it. [00:22:34] Speaker B: So until next time, stay gentle with your heart, stay open to love and let both grief and gratitude remind you that your capacity to feel deeply is holy ground. [00:22:49] Speaker C: Whatever you're experiencing and grieving, it was meant for you. It's for you. It's to help move you along. It's to support you ultimately in the big picture for your journey, for your movie. [00:23:06] Speaker B: Right? [00:23:07] Speaker C: So just know that. And we hold you just in such love and reverence. And thanks for being with us explorers. We love you so much. [00:23:17] Speaker B: Take care. [00:23:22] Speaker D: Thank you to Queenies in downtown Durham for the use of their community podcast studio and for welcoming us so warmly. Each week we'd like to give a shout out to Coco Cinnamon, the birthplace of 1023 Media and the yo podcast. Please support your local women owned minority owned coffee shop in downtown Durham. Brought to you by Durham based 1023 Media, a heart centered woman owned multimedia company.